This came up the other day.
you and I both have the same problem when posting issues about guns, we are both very protective of our forums and tend to ban people who troll, lie, insult, deflect and make a mockery of any of our threads.
having said that, unfortunately, it also means we are primarily engaging with like minded people who agree with how we post the gun control issue, so no one to get down and dirty with.
I have, and still do, go to less moderated sites so I can get into a pissing contest with gun-nuts, it usually doesn't end well, and I leave out of disgust.
I think my point is, we can lament the gun culture till the cows come home, but as long as we are unable to dissuade someone who believes guns are a God given right, we won't get very far.
this is the whole point I was making on a previous thread, we need the D,s to start winning more elections and by wider margins. though a lot of our regulars took me to task for suggesting we play dirty tricks like the R's do, what other choice do we have?
Education, facts, charts, civil discussion has led to NO change in the gun culture.
If I was running the D's I would not even raise the subject of guns, I would play the same game the R's are playing, a lot of thoughts and prayers, but keep my intentions to myself, and focus on beating Covid, getting Americans back to work, getting rid of the filibuster, and tightening up the border, so that when 2022 rolls around, hopefully keep both the house and senate, and when 2024 win big in all three branches.
ONCE the D's have a filibuster free senate, the house and the Presidency, THEN is the time to ram through gun legislation and ram it through hard. and do it right away.
But we don't tip our hands when dealing with foreign enemies so why should we with the R's?
My response
At present, my enthusiasm for engaging with folks who troll and insult is very low. As you know in the three months before the 2020 election, I went to large conservative websites to try to engage rationally and respectfully. Within about 6-7 weeks, all seven of the sites I targeted blocked all of my comments. I was never banned, just blocked somehow. My guess is that the sites blocked me because of the high number of downvotes I got from conservatives on those sites. Nearly all of the folks on those sites hated my kind of politics, facts and reasoning. Based on the insults they threw at me, I think most of 'em hated me too.
Fascism: (Wikipedia) a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy; (Merriam-Webster) (1) a political philosophy, movement, or regime that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition; (2) a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control
So, what about trolls and insulters on our sites? I ban them because they are disrespectful and cannot be reasoned with. It is false balancing to even allow their crackpot motivated reasoning, false facts, false truths and insults. What good does that do? It just foments irrational emotional reactions and that is a mental reason- and civility-killer. Minds never change, but people do get pissed off.
Most American conservatives who engage in politics online have been radicalized to the point that I consider them to be fascists at least by intent and sometimes by actions, or close enough to fascist intent to be called fascist. Before the 1/6 coup attempt, I used the label authoritarian radical right, which is a term that some experts who I respect also used. But after 1/6, the label fascist seemed to be more accurate. A few experts also use that term now.
Demagoguery: political activity or practices that seek support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people rather than by using rational argument
Wikipedia on demagogues: Demagogues have appeared in democracies since ancient Athens. They exploit a fundamental weakness in democracy: because ultimate power is held by the people, it is possible for the people to give that power to someone who appeals to the lowest common denominator of a large segment of the population. Demagogues have usually advocated immediate, forceful action to address a crisis while accusing moderate and thoughtful opponents of weakness or disloyalty. Many demagogues elected to high executive office have unraveled constitutional limits on executive power and tried to convert their democracy into a dictatorship, sometimes successfully.
It is also the case that trolls and insulters usually engage in demagoguery. That is anti-democratic and pro-authoritarian, which I judge to be immoral, or if there is malice in it, evil.
That mostly why I am going to keep banning trolls and insulters. I try to keep borderline folks engaged by asking for adherence to the rules of etiquette here. That sometimes works.
I'm not sure that is a satisfying response. For now, that's about all I can come up with. Just engaging in this kind of discourse is a bummer for me.
