Part of a 1/6 Committee transcript: What John Eastman had to say

The following is part of a transcript of questions the 1/6 Committee asked to Trump's fascist attorney John Eastman. The interview was under oath, so Eastman could be theoretically be liable for perjury if he lied. Eastman was the one who cooked up most of the legal rationale that Trump relied on to try to overthrow the government on 1/6. During the interview, he invoked the 5th Amendment at least 208 times in refusing to answer questions. That included refusing to answer questions about things he had previously discussed in public. Eastman's contempt for the 1/6 Committee was obvious.

For context, invoking the 5th Amendment allows a person to refuse to incriminate themselves in crimes or law breaking generally. The legal system cannot attach any inference of guilt from a person's refusal to answer any questions. Before he got in hot water, this is how Trump viewed people when they invoked the 5th Amendment:

Mr. Trump previously contended that invoking one’s Fifth Amendment rights was virtually an admission of wrongdoing.

“So there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment, like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” Mr. Trump said at a rally in Iowa in 2016, referring to investigations into Hillary Clinton’s handling of potentially classified material as secretary of state.

For obvious reasons, Trump is now an enthusiastic supporter of invoking the 5th Amendment.

From the transcript

Question: If nobody has any questions about the background of the witness, I'll just start getting into the more substantive questions. Dr. Eastman, in an interview with Larry Lessig and Matt Seligman on the "Another 25 Way" podcast, September 27th, 2021, you were asked about the memoranda that you wrote regarding the role of the Vice President in counting the electoral college votes on January 6th, and you said, quote, "Although I did have a client in this, the client, the President, the former President of the United States, has authorized me to talk about these things. I want to make that clear upfront," close quote. Did President Trump authorize you to talk publicly about the memoranda that you wrote? 

Answer: On the advice of counsel, I hereby assert my Fifth Amendment right against being compelled to be a witness against myself. And with the committee's permission, I will invoke this right as necessary in response to further questions by simply stating "The Fifth."  

Q: So is it your position that you can discuss those memoranda in public settings, but will not discuss those memoranda with the committee pursuant to a 15 subpoena? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: So is it your position that you can discuss in the media direct conversations you had with the President of the United States, but you will not discuss those same conversations with this committee? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Dr. Eastman, you've not produced any documents in response to the subpoena, which is in exhibit 1. Why have you not produced any documents to the committee? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Just so I understand, is it your position that the act of producing documents, as opposed to the content of the documents themselves, could tend to incriminate you? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Dr. Eastman, did you use a Chapman University email account for any 21 communications related to the 2020 election? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Dr. Eastman, did you use any other email account for communication related to the 2020 election? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Did you send or receive any text messages related to the 2020 election using your personal cell phone? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Do you have any documents regarding the 2020 election on your personal computer. 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Do you have any documents regarding the 2020 election on any server? 

A: Fifth. 

Q: Dr. Eastman, were you in Philadelphia in connection with your participation in a panel on federalism and separation of powers at the Federalist Society National Lawyers Conference that took place in November 2020? 

A: Fifth. 

You get the idea. It went on like this for a long time. Like Trump would think, did Eastman invoke the 5th because he was guilty of breaking a law(s)? Probably, ~98% chance IMO. This is part of the reason it is so hard to convict white collar criminals of just about anything illegal. Our system is heavily rigged to protect the wealthy and powerful. This exemplifies an important advantage that smart white collar criminals enjoy.